Re: Anime Thread

[Heatguts]

I guess thats why in my view the West has almost never understood the East mindset?

I think misunderstanding has a tremendous amount to do with the reception of anime in the west. Japan (I think) as a society is a lot more open to sexual content, while in the west the Christian mindset that has permeated our culture tells us such acts are inherently bad and should only be considered after marriage. Whether or not you're Christian is irrelevant as it's simply the social norm at this point.

it's still true that most anime at least attempts to provoke thought in some way, unlike the western cartoons of today.

I'll take your word for thought-provoking anime (I did see Death Note, one of probably two or three animes I've watched all the way through and the most thought provoking IMO). Also, totally agree with you on western cartoons. I don't even hear about much animated stuff nowadays (never had cable growing up as a kid so my cartoon experience was limited to PBS and Saturday mornings), I watched Avatar: The Last Airbender at one point in junior high and thought it was great, but now all I hear about are Disney's crappy live-action comedies where the stupidest junior high school protagonist is still leagues smarter than the smartest adult.

[TheAandZ]

Western Cartoons are mostly attempted copies of SpongeBob at this point. Everything is trying to be a huge joke with nothing but slapstick comedy to appeal to ages 5-12. Even remakes of older cartoons that were very story-driven and action-packed are receiving this treatment such as Teen Titans GO and the new Ben 10 remake that's coming out (also just saying that crap looks so freaking retarded I have no idea how tf that abomination was allowed to be made like seriously what crack?)

And then anything that doesn't go by this stereotype is then immediately loved and praised even tho it's actually pretty average at best (Steven Universe, SVTFOE, etc)

tl;dr Western Cartoons freaking trigger me. Especially that Ben 10 remake (no seriously like wtf it's awful not even kidding how just how what the heck I'm going to go punch a god damn wall because even talking about it triggers me holy crap)

[Neesy]

Ok ok ok... There's a lot of misinformation in this thread as well as things I'd like to expand upon so I'll do so without sounding like a nob (hopefully):

I belive the majority Japanese consider such things as Fan Service aimed at males teen to pensioner

This is untrue, I think I should put this out there first: anime / Manga, in Japan, is aimed at (mostly) for kids to teens; this is why older anime shut-ins / overly obsessed anime fans in Japan are looked down upon and mocked because it is seen as immature... Think of it as the same mentality many, including myself, have towards Bronies. Now taking this into consideration, this is the reason for most fan service: to entertain / pander to their teen audience.

The idea of loli is just someone who looks like a child. Whether or not they are (of which is where it gets bad) is a different story.

Although in essence this may be the case, the depiction of lolis aren't  23 year old women looking 16... It's literally an 11 year old child with tits. It's pushing the boundaries (if not moving them completely *cough*) on something like paedophilia which should, and still does, have very clear boundaries. It's just fucking wrong.

unlike the western cartoons of today.

I'd simply hand that to you not looking enough. People say this but, in reality, if they put the same effort in looking for a good anime as doing the same for a 'Western' cartoon, they'd find a fair few... Hell, look at how many indie animation fairs / events go on (from smallscale to big)... There are plenty and I'd argue they're easier to find than a decent anime.

Japan (I think) as a society is a lot more open to sexual content, while in the west the Christian mindset that has permeated our culture tells us such acts are inherently bad and should only be considered after marriage.

Firstly, come on dude, just say US instead of 'West' like most of what you just said doesn't apply at all to most western countries outside of the US. Secondly, this is just not true: Japan is very conservative about sexual content / conduct (gotta love that censored porn), so much so that, most guys won't kiss another girl before they've finished highschool. I'd go as far as saying that Japanese society is even more repressive of human sexuality than some regards of Christianity (I'm guessing you're referring to Catholicism) - just moreso silent societal pressure instead of blatant religious outrage.

[Deadmeat]

@ Neesy I accept your reply, I did not research this enough, I have now, and see that I was wrong, thanks for correcting me.

[Neesy]

@ Neesy I accept your reply, I did not research this enough, I have now, and see that I was wrong, thanks for correcting me.

It's nothing tbh, Japan is a very insular country. Before I went in August 2015, I had a whole lot of preconceptions about the people / society, some were close to reality, others were completely off. It's understandable, I just thought I'd add some input where I actually have (marginal) experience.

[TheAandZ]

When I say 'of today' I mean new shows. I understand that there have been good western cartoons before but I can not, for the life of me, find anything that's airing that exhibits a clear and thought-provoking story, character development or even art. Of course that may be the same for anime right now which is why I asked if anyone knew of anything good that I may or may not have seen already but I still think the difference is major enough to validate my earlier point.

Feel free to provide examples though to prove me wrong (I'd actually appreciate that)

[R93_Sniper]

This thread went places I did not expect and I am in full support of this discussion.

Also neesy that's pretty much what I was trying to say lol

[General_101]

Every mainstream "western" show these days is a copy of regular show it seems in one way or another. Adventure Time held my interest for a while and I had hoped that it would continue how it was in the beginning and continue to show a narrative behind all the comedy. Wish I could still say that these days. While it still exists it seems to be pushed to the back time and time again.

I've been planning on rewatching some anime I enjoyed a while back for nostalgia sake. It is always interesting to see how my tastes change over time. I remember having a bit of fun watching Blue Exorcist and when I rewatched it months after I found myself tired of seeing the same tropes play frequently after being exposed to many different shows.

[Heatguts]

Japan (I think) as a society is a lot more open to sexual content, while in the west the Christian mindset that has permeated our culture tells us such acts are inherently bad and should only be considered after marriage.

Firstly, come on dude, just say US instead of 'West' like most of what you just said doesn't apply at all to most western countries outside of the US. Secondly, this is just not true: Japan is very conservative about sexual content / conduct (gotta love that censored porn), so much so that, most guys won't kiss another girl before they've finished highschool. I'd go as far as saying that Japanese society is even more repressive of human sexuality than some regards of Christianity (I'm guessing you're referring to Catholicism) - just moreso silent societal pressure instead of blatant religious outrage.

Yeah you're probably right. The discussions I've heard about every other country besides the US paints the US as such a conservative nation, even though the vast majority of the younger generation seems democratic, at least in the midwest...

As far as Catholicism goes, I lived in a primarily Catholic town for a few years, also a few other towns that were mostly protestant majorities (don't know specific denominations, never bothered to ask anyone), and I have relatives in Oklahoma where everyone is Baptist as crap. Seriously it's like the most old-school conservative catholics I could find multiplied into every human being over like 30, and all the younger children are locked into the cycle at this point. The funny thing is, especially in the Catholic town I lived in (where there was a lot of this stressing of moderation among the older community) the youth seemed to disagree with their parents on pretty much everything.

[JaggyNos]

Alright, so it's been a while. I've been watching Keijo, Izetta, Yuri on Ice, Occultic;Nine, Trickster, and Bungou Stray Dogs, and I've been pretty pleased with this season, thus far.

Keijo is spectacular simply because of how absurd and hilarious it is. I haven't watched much sports anime, so this format is a bit new to me. I'm not sure if the appeal will wear off, since it seems to rely on the same things (e.g. jokes about breasts or butts, fights with some twist in the middle), but it's been great fun. There are gratuitous amounts of fanservice, which will turn some away, but I think it is weaved into the humor and story line well enough to look past it.

Izetta has also been really good, and WWII enthusiasts will probably enjoy it. The relationship between the princess and Izetta is hear-warming, and I'm eager to see how it continues to evolve throughout the rest of the season. There is some fanservice here, and it's done much more poorly than in Keijo. There's one scene where one girl gropes Izetta's body, and it doesn't add anything to the story, so I'm not a fan. Otherwise, it's pretty cool seeing the political strategies performed by the different countries.

Yuri on Ice is really good, as well. The animation, for the most part, is top-notch, but they did have to cut the quality a bit at times. What started out as gay undertones has quickly evolved into outright flirting between the two main characters, and those moments are really funny. It's fun watching Yuri grow as a person and learn more about himself, but I'm scared that the show will become worse as the series progresses.

I have not enjoyed Occultic;Nine that much, mostly because of the pacing. Episode one makes you feel like you just watched a movie in 20 minutes, making it extremely difficult to follow what's actually going on. I've only seen through episode 3 so far, so I'm a bit behind, but each episode does not make me want to keep watching it. I've certainly found it interesting, but it's also exhausting to watch each episode. If it continues like this, I think I'll just drop it and read the LN.

Trickster has been fun, but the edgy main character makes it really hard to enjoy this show. There are two main characters, one happy and one depressing, and the two should play off of each other. However, it feels like the depressing one just complains about how people's lives don't matter all the time, while the happy one tries to justify the other's mentality. It might get better as the season progresses, and I'll probably stick with it, but it hasn't been that good.

And finally, Bungou Stray Dogs has continued to be fantastic. The first four episodes were darker and had a noire feeling, but the tone quickly changed when it was brought back to the present. That being said, the latest episodes haven't been filled with the same bs that riddled season 1. There has not been a great number of dumb flashbacks (if you watch season 1, be prepared to see the same orphanage scene several times), and tense scenes aren't ruined by ill-timed jokes. The pacing has been pretty good, and each episode does a good job of keeping me engaged and excited. Overall, I'm really please with season 2, and I'm excited to see where it goes.

[Abdul Fatir]

Hmmm.. All of those sound good! Don't know why i can't take out some time for anime. I wanna but can't :| The last i saw was "Spice and Wolf" and was superb!

[R93_Sniper]

Spice and wolf was pretty good, but it made you really pay attention to understand what was going on.

[Jaing]

not even a joke, tom and jerry were legit 
esp. when chuck produced it

[Neesy]

My grandad used to always tell me how much controversy Tom&Jerry created over depictions of violence in cartoons when it first aired.

[Abdul Fatir]

Spice and wolf was pretty good, but it made you really pay attention to understand what was going on.

Yup, this anime was kinda hard to understand at some places. And especially the Accent.. Urghhh..!

[R93_Sniper]

English dub for it was one of the few good ones out there

[Jaing]

My grandad used to always tell me how much controversy Tom&Jerry created over depictions of violence in cartoons when it first aired.

Well yea i mean in every episode tom always get the shit beaten out of him for no reason except jerry's just a d*** and spike is his brainless [EXPUNGED] 

so i'm not surprised if controversy was generated. But the show had it's moments more often than not- the cowboy tom episode and 'crambo' still make me laugh :)

edit: wow u guys censor shit now? :((

[R93_Sniper]

Shit been censored from the get go actually

[Heatguts]

My grandad used to always tell me how much controversy Tom&Jerry created over depictions of violence in cartoons when it first aired.

Well yea i mean in every episode tom always get the shit beaten out of him for no reason except jerry's just a d*** and spike is his brainless [EXPUNGED] 

so i'm not surprised if controversy was generated. But the show had it's moments more often than not- the cowboy tom episode and 'crambo' still make me laugh :)

edit: wow u guys censor shit now? :((

Pretty sure I saw the cowboy tom one. I had a DVD as a kid with a few episodes (along with some other DVDs of other TV shows) and because I didn't have cable dem DVDs were the only non-educational cartoons I saw unless I was in a hotel until netflix started streaming stuff.

I remember there was this one episode that confused the crap out of me as a kid that was set in what I believe was Italy or Monaco and there was this other gray mouse I never learned the name of and at the end of the episode the gray mouse said something in French or Italian as he left on a boat and it all left me super confused.

[Jaing]

Christ when cartoon network was all i was interested in they would run the same episodes of tom and jerry again and again and again. I'm pretty confident in saying if anyone were to show me a random tom and jerry episode, there's a 70% chance i would be able to transcript it off the top of my head. What happened to cartoons man 

Mental list of my favourite episodes: 
- the one with tom and jerry on a space station
- beach episode (muscle beach)
- the episode where the leash law is enacted and tom finally gets his revenge on spike, albeit only for a while

nowadays its shit like steven universe and world of gumpball. While we're at shitty cartoons actually i never really understood the obsession with spongebob. Ain't funny nor relatable yo 

even the memes that came from it are crap

sorry for hijacking your anime thread boys, but I don't see the need to create another western cartoon thread :) x

[R93_Sniper]

Anime == Cartoon == Western Cartoon

Its legit the same just from different regions. Anybody who wants to go into the semantics is too much of a diehard imo.

[Abdul Fatir]

@Jaing
Yeah... CN used to have Toonami section too. :c
KAMEHAMENOOO!!!

[Neesy]

Anime == Cartoon == Western Cartoon

Its legit the same just from different regions. Anybody who wants to go into the semantics is too much of a diehard imo.

Literally screams weeb to me

[TheAandZ]

Anime == Cartoon == Western Cartoon

Its legit the same just from different regions. Anybody who wants to go into the semantics is too much of a diehard imo.

I would normally agree with you. However the ever prevalent differences of style, content and target audience between them, let's call them American Cartoons and Japanese Cartoons (I know I'm generalizing gimme a break here), is obvious enough that it warrants comparison.

[General_101]

I remember an interesting explanation where just about anything animation related falls under anime in Japan as anime is quite literally just short for animation. In places like the USA, the term anime is used to separate "western" cartoons from "Japanese" cartoons. The idea is that this is how a niche fanbase in another region would identify the product to other people in their region. In other words, anime has a different meaning based on who you ask in a certain part of the world.

It came from a Youtube comment so it could be a load of shit though.

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